Women in Business Panel
Dublin Business School hosted an excellent talk by four women in business, on 23rd October 2019. The fourth floor common room was crowded with students, some standing at the back, gaining valuable insights. Each of the speakers had taken unique and twisting paths to reach their current positions.
Thanks to Eadaoin Curtin, Sinead Lucey, Simone Nairn, Cliona O’Beirne.
16% of MD roles go to women
Journeys
Eadaoin Curtin told us of her journey towards owning her own photography studio. She lived abroad during the Celtic Tiger, then returned to work in architecture, living with her parents and caring for a relative with dementia. As she was doing hard work on low pay, she started Teaching English as a Foreign Language (TEFL) as well and enjoyed this a lot more. She gradually got back into the photography she had loved as a child and this helped to unleash her creativity. Now she runs her own business full time.
Sinead Lucey is a business development manager, originally from Cork. She started by studying Applied Languages in Dublin City University (DCU) and became an interpreter. She took a Masters Degree as Applied Interpreter in Bath, UK and carried out European Union (EU) and court work in Dublin and London. However, Sinead found that she enjoyed the IT side of work and wanted her own business. She did some work as a fraud investigator for Amazon and learnt a great deal. Next she moved back to Cork and took a sales operations role in TMC Technology Limited to repay student debt. This was in software licensing and projects. From there she went to work with Dell as her manager put her forward for the role. She found the customer experience side of the business rewarding and eye opening. At the end of April this year, she left the corporate job to work in a startup.
Mentors
Have the end in mind and work towards it.
Sinead: she provides mentoring to Girls In Tech Dublin as a voluntary manager. This year Girls In Tech ran a hackathon to help make Non Governmental Organisations (NGOs) and charities more efficient. This gave young people access to experienced mentors and the NGOs had access to young starters. She said that if she was starting again, she would have the end in mind and work towards it better. Women can find it difficult to talk about money. She suggested asking what you want to achieve and planning out five and ten year chunks — but be open to change.
Eadaoin: she would listen to feedback from mentors more, if she was starting again. She had skills and talent as a designer but even when praised did not have confidence. The man next to her with no honours degree was being paid 15% more than her, because she didn’t ask for more pay. She recommended to network, as people didn’t know her photography firm existed and when they did know they were willing to hire her.
Simone Nairn: she worked really hard as an Managing Director (MD) and had two children, and the hectic life meant she would advise students to take the time to reflect and be kind to themselves. McKinsey hired her and their top line are all mature overachievers who don’t value themselves.
The future
Ten years ago people didn’t understand branding but now they all know what it means, for a company or individual. Manage your brand.
Cliona O’Beirne: never look back because a career is about looking forward. She travelled the world in the course of work, and when someone in another firm asked to meet the man in charge of her, she had to explain that she was the person who made the decisions.
Sinead: tech is changing so fast, by the time new students graduate, tech will have changed again. A growth mindset and adapting to innovation will be critical personal skills.
Eadaoin: ten years ago people didn’t understand branding but now they all know what it means, for a company or individual. Manage your brand.
We don’t know what roles people will have in the future, so invest in adaptability.
Simone: we don’t know what roles people will have in the future, so invest in adaptability. She considers that while at one time the employer interviewed the employee, now the employee interviews the employer too. At Irish Life, she found the work-life balance doesn’t exist because the employee is expected to bring their whole life on board. Four generations can be working together in some large firms, and this adds layers of complexity. The tech may be old-fashioned (to a new graduate employee) and mindsets old-fashioned. Reverse mentoring needs to occur, where someone older is mentored by a young person.
Cliona: in education, like she manages at DBS, a curriculum has to be developed to cater for a truly global student body. Digitisation is impacting this greatly, changing delivery methods.
Eadaoin: in architecture there wasn’t a culture of mentoring, everyone had to get their own work done, but as a business owner this has been really important. She joined a network for creative entrepreneurs and found a lot of work contacts. She needed to learn how to sell. Also, to make family time and stop working eighteen hour days.
Role models
Role models are needed for women.
Simone: role models are needed for women. Work hard and you will be successful, but it can be harder for women to rise. As she advanced, she needed to learn new skill sets. She advised us to put ladders down (to help others) rather than put them up (to climb on).
Cliona: her mother worked as a nurse but had to stop when she married, (as there was a marriage bar in the Civil Service for women) and when the bar was lifted she resumed work with four children and worked until she was seventy. DBS was owned by a husband and wife team originally and they proved a great inspiration.
Advice
Cliona: Women need more confidence.
Simone: confidence but also resilience; don’t be afraid of failure. The world is a much nicer place now than when she started in business.
Eadaoin: great leaders ask great questions. Help other people. And remember it’s okay not to feel great. Don’t be afraid to ask for help.
Sinead: we need resilience and confidence, yes. Also empathy and emotional intelligence. Know and develop your strengths. You can hire someone whose strengths match your weaknesses.
Masculine business culture
It’s hardest for the first female executive on the board, after that it is easier for the next women as you educate your colleagues.
Cliona: matters are changing for the better. Keep pushing for improvement.
Simone: it’s hardest for the first female executive on the board, after that it is easier for the next women as you educate your colleagues. Ask colleagues if they want to tell their daughter or niece that only 16% of MD roles go to women, as they presently do.
Eadaoin: in prehistoric times, hoe agriculture was carried out by women, but with the invention of the plough, the work shifted to men. Men were stronger and the plough was heavy, and it wasn’t safe to have small children near the plough animals, which were managed by the men. A gendered workplace has existed for a long time. This is the Industrial Revolution 5.0 — back to human power. People with health issues can work now, but not 9–5.
Sinead: we should be confident and frame conversations in a certain way, as communication is important. At times a woman will be in a room with twelve male colleagues, so keep working on communication skills.
Leadership
Simone: leadership takes time to develop. People don’t look for perfection, they just want someone to guide and support them.
Learning skills on the job
Pick up transferable skills
Sinead: Human Resource (HR) skills are transferable, for example, so you can go into many firms with these. Go first to an organisation where you will have an opportunity to learn a lot, fast. Pick up transferable skills and when you move to another firm which does not have that skillset, you can bring it in to that workplace.
